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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 25, 2017, 3:32 pm 
guest wrote:
Is the St Clair River a private or public waterway. Also how do you impede traffic when the river is closed to navigation?


Just because you can do something legally, doesn't mean you should..

Besides that's what the Colorado river is for.


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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 25, 2017, 9:55 am 
Is the St Clair River a private or public waterway. Also how do you impede traffic when the river is closed to navigation?


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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 25, 2017, 9:33 am 
One day a year people meet on a hot day to float down the river. the commercial boys think they own the river -- they do not !


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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 25, 2017, 4:24 am 
Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:
The Coast Guard discourages it only because it’s not a safe, controlled event. Just read the statistics from the event.
1) 3 lives saved
2) 168 life assisted
3) 2 arrested
4) 2 missing, located later

…………and the Float Down was slower than usual due to the south wind.

The event was not sanctioned, authorized or approved by any structured organization that could set safe guidelines and regulations that would include the Coast Guard guidance and required support staff.

25 law enforcement agencies with over 60 boats assisted throughout the day including the Canadian Coast Guard, Ontario Provincial Police, St. Clair County Sheriff Marine Division, Port Huron Police, Port Huron Fire Department, U.S. Customs and Border Protection, St. Clair fire and police departments, Burtchville Fire Department, Marysville police and fire departments, among others.

As it was very well written earlier:
Last but not least, cost and resources diverted. There is a HUGE cost to the Coast Guard, local law enforcement agencies, and homeland security. They are trying to maintain the safety of the participants, which is great. But in doing so, they are compromising the other duties they are normally tasked with, and subsequently, compromising security we might normally take for granted if the Float Down never happened in the first place. Never mind the potential risks of a boater elsewhere who needs assistance.

Without all the assistance from the agencies listed the statistics could have easily read 171 lives lost and 2 arrested 2 missing, located later.

With the information above I believe this should help answer your question.


On a practical level, how could it be stopped ? Unless laws are being broken, this will continue.

Well they actually are impeding a navigational water , really no different than when the fisherman refuse to give way to vessels attempting to transit. As stated it is unsanctioned. No different if a group decided to skateboard down a large hill section of a freeway for the fun of it and caused all traffic to stop do to safety concerns. Because of where this is located they actually could fine people. Which is what they should of done at the very first one which would of curbed it in the first place. As with fisherman that impede vessels until they actually start to fine people it won't stop.


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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 24, 2017, 1:08 pm 
Quote:
25 law enforcement agencies with over 60 boats assisted throughout the day including the Canadian Coast Guard, Ontario Provincial Police, St. Clair County Sheriff Marine Division, Port Huron Police, Port Huron Fire Department, U.S. Customs and Border Protection, St. Clair fire and police departments, Burtchville Fire Department, Marysville police and fire departments, among others.

Looks more like a fine training day for all involved and I very much question the over blown claim of "171 lives saved"
Offering someone a hand or give them a tow does not mean those persons would have otherwise drowned.

Looking forward to next year's event, sanctioned or not.
.


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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 23, 2017, 7:33 am 
Guest wrote:
The Coast Guard discourages it only because it’s not a safe, controlled event. Just read the statistics from the event.
1) 3 lives saved
2) 168 life assisted
3) 2 arrested
4) 2 missing, located later

…………and the Float Down was slower than usual due to the south wind.

The event was not sanctioned, authorized or approved by any structured organization that could set safe guidelines and regulations that would include the Coast Guard guidance and required support staff.

25 law enforcement agencies with over 60 boats assisted throughout the day including the Canadian Coast Guard, Ontario Provincial Police, St. Clair County Sheriff Marine Division, Port Huron Police, Port Huron Fire Department, U.S. Customs and Border Protection, St. Clair fire and police departments, Burtchville Fire Department, Marysville police and fire departments, among others.

As it was very well written earlier:
Last but not least, cost and resources diverted. There is a HUGE cost to the Coast Guard, local law enforcement agencies, and homeland security. They are trying to maintain the safety of the participants, which is great. But in doing so, they are compromising the other duties they are normally tasked with, and subsequently, compromising security we might normally take for granted if the Float Down never happened in the first place. Never mind the potential risks of a boater elsewhere who needs assistance.

Without all the assistance from the agencies listed the statistics could have easily read 171 lives lost and 2 arrested 2 missing, located later.

With the information above I believe this should help answer your question.


On a practical level, how could it be stopped ? Unless laws are being broken, this will continue.


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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 22, 2017, 12:28 pm 
Just a lot of people having fun on a hot August day !


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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 22, 2017, 12:28 pm 
Thanks. These replies provide more clarity. The only reply here that I don't understand is the issue of drifting into shipping lanes. I understood that the river was closed to shipping during the float down. Am I mistake on this?


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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 22, 2017, 11:47 am 

Joined: July 2, 2010, 1:36 pm
Posts: 563
Guest wrote:

I don't think there is a "River Rafting Association" anywhere who would/could sanction it but there isn't, so what is the problem?



The problem is that the very nature of the event is so ill advised that it is unsanctionable, and would be even if there was some kind of association to put its name on it.

The entrance to the St. Clair River is where outflow from three of the largest bodies of freshwater in the world squeezes itself into a narrow channel at the top of a long downhill run. This is not the Apple River in Wisconsin, this is not the Deschutes River in Oregon. Those are the types of river where a float down makes more sense and can be a lot of fun and much safer even if people are using alcohol. The St. Clair is a different beast; it's not the best place to be doing a float.


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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 22, 2017, 9:31 am 
The Coast Guard discourages it only because it’s not a safe, controlled event. Just read the statistics from the event.
1) 3 lives saved
2) 168 life assisted
3) 2 arrested
4) 2 missing, located later

…………and the Float Down was slower than usual due to the south wind.

The event was not sanctioned, authorized or approved by any structured organization that could set safe guidelines and regulations that would include the Coast Guard guidance and required support staff.

25 law enforcement agencies with over 60 boats assisted throughout the day including the Canadian Coast Guard, Ontario Provincial Police, St. Clair County Sheriff Marine Division, Port Huron Police, Port Huron Fire Department, U.S. Customs and Border Protection, St. Clair fire and police departments, Burtchville Fire Department, Marysville police and fire departments, among others.

As it was very well written earlier:
Last but not least, cost and resources diverted. There is a HUGE cost to the Coast Guard, local law enforcement agencies, and homeland security. They are trying to maintain the safety of the participants, which is great. But in doing so, they are compromising the other duties they are normally tasked with, and subsequently, compromising security we might normally take for granted if the Float Down never happened in the first place. Never mind the potential risks of a boater elsewhere who needs assistance.

Without all the assistance from the agencies listed the statistics could have easily read 171 lives lost and 2 arrested 2 missing, located later.

With the information above I believe this should help answer your question.


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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 21, 2017, 8:53 pm 

Joined: December 7, 2014, 8:11 am
Posts: 76
Rob wrote:
I'm curious as to why the float down is considered such a dangerous activity, why the coast guard discourages it. I'm sure alcohol is involved in most of the mishaps, but is there some inherent danger? I'm almost afraid to ask this, but is it just pure idiocy and lunacy at play here?


From an observers point of view, there are several factors at play whicj I'll try to share and I'm sure I'm not covering all of them nor are they in a specific order:

1. Alcohol Abuse. You mentioned this and it is a real factor for a lot of the rescues from what I've heard. I go to Lighthouse Beach every year to watch the spectacle and this is the first year I've not seen someone actually laying on the beach passed out or worse.

2. The lack of people using personal flotation devices. So many people relying on their "vessel" alone as their only means of flotation.

3. The stability of their vessel part one. There are a lot of home made flotation "vessels" that might be great in a swimming pool or gentle inland lake, but not so great in the current under the bridge.

4. The stability of their vessel part two. Lots of people use flotation devices that are intended for their home pool, or for a tent (air mattresses for example) and these are hard to control in currents under the bridge or when there is wind.

5. Last but not least, cost and resources diverted. There is a HUGE cost to the Coast Guard, local law enforcement agencies, and homeland security. They are trying to maintain the safety of the participants, which is great. But in doing so, they are compromising the other duties they are normally tasked with, and subsequently, compromising security we might normally take for granted if the Float Down never happened in the first place. Nevermind the potential risks of a boater elsewhere who needs assistance.

That in a nutshell would be the big factors why the agencies consider it dangerous.


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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 21, 2017, 3:52 pm 
I was wondering what would make an "un-sanctioned" event into a "sanctioned" one?

This wording seems to be used over and over by the Coast Guard and others, but why?

I don't think there is a "River Rafting Association" anywhere who would/could sanction it but there isn't, so what is the problem?

Just let it be.


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 Post subject: Re: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 21, 2017, 2:49 pm 
1) You can drift into the shipping lanes with no directional control to your craft.

2) You are in a fast moving river that is upwards of 3/4 mile wide, and can be far from shore.

3) It's not an organized event, thus no real support vessels in the area, nor any "roped off" areas that other boaters will not be in, nor restrictions to your craft or requirements for life jackets.

4) You can drift over the border.

5) And yes, alcohol, which impairs judgment when in trouble.

These are just a few...


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 Post subject: Float Down
Unread postPosted: August 21, 2017, 12:12 pm 
I'm curious as to why the float down is considered such a dangerous activity, why the coast guard discourages it. I'm sure alcohol is involved in most of the mishaps, but is there some inherent danger? I'm almost afraid to ask this, but is it just pure idiocy and lunacy at play here?


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