Boatnerd Discussion Forum

Actually, the majority of Great Lakes Pilots are former 'Laker Captains and Mates. The pay is about the same, but the work schedule is a little more forgiving with mandatory rest periods for a certain number of bridge hours. The trade off, of course, is the living out of a suitcase, driving hours repeatedly to catch your next ship, less than steller accomodations and often questionable food. In fact, one of the leading illnesses that forces Pilots ashore to recoup is food poisening. The grub aboard even the most frugally operated 'Laker is nearly a cruise ship worthy menu.

44C2PRJim, My take on this is that the Great Lakes Freighters Captains and Mates have a better take on this than the Pilots that bring the salties through the river. It shouldn't be that way, but like I said, that is a particularly bad area. It grows quite a bit each season, and most skippers give it a wider berth, closer to the Pt Aux Pins range line when D/B Loaded.

Charlie suggested shoaling in area of Brush Pt and Pte Louise. I would agree with some shoaling around and near crib lights and channel markers but if it has extented as far into the channel as he suggests. Then why only 1 ship grounding in this area?.Yes ships have depth sounders, but they only tell you how much water is under the keel not what is ahead. In the above area there may be as little as 1 to 1 and a half feet of water under the keel so the sounder is useless as a warning devise for shoaling. any warning would be too late any ways. The ship I am on, when going 12 knots and if you go straight from full ahead to full astern, it will take a touch over half a nautical mile to stop going ahead. In this area we go thru at about 10 knots. thats alot of warning needed for possible shoaling ahead. Just a little more fodder on this topic for you.

In a recent posting, someone said all the lake boats now have depth sounders. If so, would that give the crew warning of shoaling water?

Yes the Block is loaded, I should not have assumed otherwise without facts first. we sailed down by Brush Pt today at 26' 06". waterlevel in upper pool -3". no problem. Just the same the Block had to have been to close to light to hit bottom. Anyone know why it did not continue on to Duluth? Instead it went back down river on to Lake Huron

I was wondering if there might be some shoaling going on and if there had been any recent dredging. I do think it would be odd that this might be operator error since these captains have so much experience with the area. And when I was referencing water levels, I was thinking of how they can fluctuate so quickly, not the standard levels, and how any such fluctuation might quickly impact their circumstances.

SBest is correct. Block was loaded. Also, the area along the edge of the channel, abreast of and just downstream of Brush Pt. is notorious for shoaling in. The material is mostly sand, but can strech several hundred feet out into the channel. I don't believe this area has been dredged for some time now. Probably not since I retired from the Corps. I'm sure the local survey vessel will be taking a look at it soon.

But the Joe Block was loaded, although the Algobay was not. The Block has a full load of stone from Cedarville that it was taking to Duluth to unload.

I do not believe the water level has anything to do with groundings because of ship status and locations. Both Algobay and Joe Block were in ballast, with the Block not even in the river...having touched bottom at De Tour reef light. tells me they were too close to light when passing by. The Bay touched bottom at Johnson's Pt. in ballast and damaged starboard side ballat tanks. This tells me they were too far to the starboard side of the deep channel either before reaching Johnson's or after making the turn at Johnson's Pt. Now the Iryda was loaded with cargo but seeing as it was heading over seas it would be loaded to be of seaway draft (about 26' 07" passing down St. Mary's River) This is normal draft at present water levels...even the 1,000 footers and other lake Michigan ore boats are at or near this draft. To go aground at brush Pt you have to fail to make the turn to go between Brush and Pte Louise...the channel is wide and deep enough for vessels to pass by there while in the channel.

There seems to be many groundings in the past several days in the St. Mary's River and Soo area. First the Algobay on 13 April 2010, then the salty Iryda on 16 April 2010, and now the Joseph L. Block on 19 April 2010. Just wondering what might be going on. Is the river level lower than what it might normally be? Maybe water levels are shifting very frequently from reports the captains might be getting and thus the groundings?

Open discussion for all who might have any information about current conditions along the river and what might be causing these unfortunate mishaps.