Boatnerd Discussion Forum

Guest wrote:

guest7 wrote:The GSA site shows the Storis auction closed with reserve not met. Two bidders with a high bid of $70,100.

$70K would have met the reserve. The story says the reserve was not met.

The minimum bid was $60,000, that was not the reserve. I suspect that the reserve was considerably higher.

guest7 wrote:The GSA site shows the Storis auction closed with reserve not met. Two bidders with a high bid of $70,100.

$70K would have met the reserve. The story says the reserve was not met.

The GSA site shows the Storis auction closed with reserve not met. Two bidders with a high bid of $70,100.

Anyone keep track of how the auction ended? Last I looked, about 2 hours before bidding closed, the high bid was $65,100, with the reserve not being met.

The minimum starting bid on the Storis is $60,000, and the GSA will not say what the reserve or minimum sales price is. That is a fair amount for an old ship.

Also, could the moderators move the material on the Acushnet to the Acushnet thread?

Guest wrote:How can anyone estimate the cost of purchasing a old ship until after it has been checked over by professionals and Coast Guard regulations and rules have been met ?

Not sure which ship you are referring too. If the Acushnet, the ship was already sold to a purchaser who did not have the foggiest idea of what he was doing. As for costs, the Coast Guard requirements are listed as unknown, and I do not know what may have been stripped from the ship following purchase. Fifteen tons of spare parts are missing. I am looking at what it would cost to get the ship to the Great Lakes under some sort of lease agreement, if the actual ownership can be sorted out. Presently, the whereabouts of the owner are unknown. The last report was that he was bailed out of jail in Utah, and then has vanished.

The deal did not "fall through" in the traditional sense. It's more complicated than that. In the purest, simplest sense, the government changed the circumstances and terms of the negotiations using a seven-year-old agreement they pulled out of their hat at the last minute to basically claim all their obligations under federal preservation law had been fulfilled. The timing is questionable at best. They only notified Storis Museum when it was too late to do anything about it up front. Storis Museum has no culpability in this matter and is still actively pursuing acquisition of Storis from the government and has several people including preservation professionals and an attorney working on the issues at hand.

Jon Ottman
Preservation Consultant, Detroit, MI
on behalf of Storis Museum, Juneau, AK

davidfrank wrote:I'm guessing the estimated fuel cost is too low and the crew cost is too high.

You could run the Acushnet as a yacht from Anacortes to Lake Michigan using a largely volunteer crew. Pay for a captain and and an engineer if you must. The rest of the volunteers can pay their own transportation and donate $500 for their room and board costs. You are offering a free cruise - you shouldn't have to pay the cruisers. And the cruisers are allowed to touch things, do important jobs, and go everywhere on the ship. What can be better than that. There are experienced people out there, even captains, who would do the trip just to have an adventure for 6 weeks.

I was assuming that the report of 25,000 to 30,000 gallons of fuel onboard was correct, and figured on needing at least 20,000 gallons of additional fuel.

As for a crew of volunteers, NO. They will be paid, if only a nominal sum, and the captain will have the authority to fire them if need be, and put them off of the ship. Technically, I could carry 12 passengers without having problems with the Coast Guard regarding a passenger ship, but if I did that, those will not be members of the crew. They will have to eat the same food as the crew, and live in the same quarters.

As for not paying the crew,in today's economy I wouldn't count on that. Not many i know can afford 40 plus days unpaid.

How can anyone estimate the cost of purchasing a old ship until after it has been checked over by professionals and Coast Guard regulations and rules have been met ?

I'm guessing the estimated fuel cost is too low and the crew cost is too high.

You could run the Acushnet as a yacht from Anacortes to Lake Michigan using a largely volunteer crew. Pay for a captain and and an engineer if you must. The rest of the volunteers can pay their own transportation and donate $500 for their room and board costs. You are offering a free cruise - you shouldn't have to pay the cruisers. And the cruisers are allowed to touch things, do important jobs, and go everywhere on the ship. What can be better than that. There are experienced people out there, even captains, who would do the trip just to have an adventure for 6 weeks.

The following is my initial estimate of the costs of moving the Acushnet from Anacortes, Washington to Milwaukee. I think that I can guarantee that the total will be higher by a fair amount.

Estimated costs for moving Acushnet from Anacortes, Washington to Milwaukee.

Fuel: minimum of 20,000 gallons at $4/gallon, $80,000
Unpaid bills: known $120,000, unknown $?
Provisioning: 20 men for 45 days at $20/day, $18,000
Insurance for ship: $30,000 to $50,000
Insurance for crew: assume 20 men at $1500/man, $30,000
Expenses to get crew to ship: 20 men at $600/man, $12,000
Crew Expenses: Assume they will accept $75/day/man for 20 men for 45 days, $67,500
Workman’s Comp Insurance: $?
Unemployment Insurance: $?
Canal Costs: Not yet researched
Seaway Pilot costs: Not yet researched
Coast Guard SOLAS requirements: unknown
Navigation Equipment: circa $10,000, may be low

Total Known: $275,000

I would hazard a guess that the Storis costs will be higher, as the ship is going to need a lot more work, equipment, and fuel.

Guest wrote:How is your attempted purchase of the Acushnet coming?

Aside from the legal mess, and the Coast Guard questioning the validity of the original sale, there is the cost of trying to get her from the Seattle area to the Great Lakes. The more I dig, the more it costs. I do not have unlimited funds, and I do not know how much more has been stripped from the ship.

Must be the museum deal fell through. Could be a better boat for you than Acushnet, Dale.

Key issues here: 1. The STORIS Museum group has been working for 7 years to secure the ship. Congress pulled donation language out of CG Appropriations bills that would have donated the ship. There were some politicians that called the potential donation an earmark. So the venue switched to GSA. Ultimately, the GSA used a technicality in preservation law using a seven-year-old agreement written up before the ship was decommissioned to end good-faith negotiations with the STORIS Museum in order to put the ship up for public auction. The GSA didn't have to do the wrong thing and take the easy way out, but they chose to.

2. Though it's buried deep in the text, the ship is listed as nationally significant on the National Register of Historic Places. If she is modified for any use other than as she is currently configured such as to bring her up to current USCG/ABS Regs, she could be delisted. There will be many very unhappy people, particularly CG Vets. 3. She is not ice-capable despite the listing. She cracked internal ribs ca 1999 as a result of metal fatigue. In her last years of service, she did not have ice rating from the Coast Guard and was not allowed to go into the ice.

It's obvious that the word is getting out about STORIS being placed up for auction. The messages of support received by the STORIS Museum are greatly appreciated. We are also getting some very generous expressions through financial support. STORIS Museum is continuing to pursue the ship with the assistance of some strong financial backing and we are prepared to bid on the ship.

What will be helpful is for all of the ship's supporters to make it clear to anyone who may be interested in bidding on the ship against the museum:

DON'T BID.

As we said, STORIS is a 71-year-old patrol ship, can't break ice, doesn't have a hold, and isn't a freighter, cruise ship, a survey ship or a yacht. STORIS Museum has been working on trying to save this ship as a museum vessel for over seven years now and we hope that other people will respect that and allow us to do what needs to be done to secure the ship without outside interference or others driving up the purchase price of the ship. Worse yet, we don't want to see her go to the breakers. The more we have to spend to try to acquire the ship is less money that goes into rehabilitation.

There are lots of other ships out there that are for sale, that are equipped for various tasks that people may need or want to perform, and that need good homes. THERE IS ONLY ONE STORIS, and we have some great plans for her preservation and interpretation. We need to get the ship first to make that become a reality and we are working hard on making that happen.

Thank you,
Jon Ottman
Preservation Consultant
STORIS Museum, Juneau, AK

How is your attempted purchase of the Acushnet coming?

The former USCGC Storis, which accompanied the Bramble through the Northwest Passage is up for GSA auction.

1942 UNITED STATES COAST GUARD STORIS (WMEC-38), MAKE/MANUFACTURER: TOLEDO SHIPBUILDING, MODEL: SUPPLY SHIP, DATE OF MANUFACTURER: APRIL 4, 1942, VESSEL NAME: USCGC STORIS, HULL NO: WMEC-38, SEAWORTHY: YES, VESSEL LENGTH: 230, ENGINE MISSING: NO, ENGINE HOURS: UNKNOWN, MARINE SURVEY: NO, THIS VESSEL IS A MEDIUM ENDURANCE CUTTER WHICH WAS USED FOR LAW ENFORCEMENT AND FISHERIES. CUTTER IS EQUIPPED WITH THREE EMD 645EG ENGINES CONNECTED TO THREE WESTINGHOUSE DC GENERATORS PROVIDING POWER TO ONE WESTINGHOUSE DC PROPULSION MOTOR (1800 HP)CUTTER REPOWERED IN 1986. PROPELLER IS 10 FEET-6 INCHES IN DIAMETER X 7 FEET-4 INCHES PITCH, 5 BLADE RH BRONZE. HULL IS RIVETED STEEL, FULL LOAD DISPLACEMENT IS 1710 LONG TONS. SHAFT BEARING FORWARD, ORION THRUST SHAFT BEARING AFT, THORDON. SHAFT SEALS FORE AND AFT: JOHN CRANE TYPE MX9, TANK CAPACITY DIESEL OIL 324 LONG TONS, FRESH WATER: 93 LONG TONS. COAST GUARD CREW SIZE: 10 OFFICERS AND 68 CREW MEMBERS WITH SEPARATE CREW QUARTERS FOR BOTH MEN AND WOMEN. LAST DRY DOCKING OF CUTTER WAS IN 2007 PRIOR TO ENTRY INTO THE READY RESERVE FLEET. HULL WAS CLEANED AND HULL RECOATED TO PREVENT SLUFFING OF HULL PAINT. THE TWO, 22 FOOT, MODEL H630 ZODIAC BOATS CURRENTLY ON BOARD THE CUTTER WILL CONVEY WITH THE CUTTER BOAT HIN: XDC63248C000 AND XDC63193E898. CUTTER ALSO EQUIPPED WITH A HYDRAULIC CARGO BOOM ON FORWARD PART OF THE CUTTER. CUTTER WAS ORIGINALLY DESIGNED TO BE A SUPPLY VESSEL FOR OPERATIONS IN GREENLAND (NORTH ATLANTIC, THE CUTTER HAS SOME DEGREE OF ICE BREAKING CAPABILITY. SHIP CIRCUMENAVIGATED NORTH AMERICA VIA NORTHWEST PASSAGE WITH CGC CUTTERS BRAMBLE AND SPAR IN 1957. VESSEL ADDED TO THE REGISTER OF HISTORICAL PLACES IN DECEMBER 2012. CUTTER HOMEPORTED IN ALASKA 1990 UNTIL 2007 WHEN IT WAS REMOVED FROM ACTIVE SERVICE AND MOVED TO THE RRF, SUISUN BAY, CA. THE CONDIITON CODE OF "REPAIRABLE" DUE TO REMOVAL OF SHIP ELECTRONICS AND ABSENCE OF WORKING RADIO OR WORKING RADAR. NEXT OWNER/OPERATOR WILL HAVE TO PROVIDE A VALID CERTIFICATE OF FINANCIAL RESPONSIBILITY (COFR) BEFORE ACCEPTING CUSTODY OF THE CUTTER. NEXT OWNER/OPERATOR ALSO RESPONSIBLE FOR ANY REQUIREMENTS TO CLEAN HULL FOR COMPLIANCE WITH NON-INDIGENOUS SPECIES ACT BEFORE CUTTER DEPARTS SAN FRANCISCO BAY AREA.