Algoma Fleet

[Guest]

While this is almost reaching for straws, perhaps they could be willing to lease her out and maintain some control. Was said here that this is what CSL and Lower Lakes did last season with the Frontenac, for instance.

Then if she becomes a liability for Algoma's own business rather than just a source of income, the charter could not be renewed and she could be disposed of at hopefully higher prices than today.

She may as well earn her keep rather than have to pay dock fees on an asset they don't intend to use again but don't want to sell in today's depressed scrap market, but they have to walk the line carefully of course since they're in the business of operating lakers themselves.

It can't strategically benefit a competitor, but if Lower Lakes has a contract and will haul that cargo one way or another, Algoma may as well make a little something out of the deal for a season or two.

[tugboathunter]

The previous poster did say that the Algosteel was being marketed. This can be taken several ways, but I think he may have meant that she's being marketed for scrap, since he mentioned that the other five are being mothballed until the price of scrap rises. If he meant being marketed to anybody, then it seems highly unlikely CSL or LLT would have the demand necessary to facilitate running her, whether Algoma would sell to them or not.

[Chris M]

Algoma would never sell to LLT (or anyone else), they're a competitor, especially with hauling salt

[Guest]

I can't imagine much of a market for the Algosteel unfortunately if business is that soft - which it is across all sectors. What shape is the Algosar in? When it was with Cleveland Tankers I heard it was immaculately maintained? Would the Algosar also be a candidate for sale for off-lakes use?

The Algosar is now a 39 year old tanker, and is now deemed as a high risk asset to the petroleum companies. She was a tremendous carrier, and was in good shape, but unfortunately her ballast tanks were not coated, and her scantlings were not robust, leading to wastage in her steel. She can carry a "gut" load of cargo at minimum draft, and there hasn't been another tanker that can come close to that lifting capability.

[Guest]

The Algosteel may find a buyer. It's being marketed. The other 5 are being mothballed for now and will remain so until the price of scrap is more promising. I work for the company and its a combo of the boats meeting their end lives, the new boats we have introduced and sobering economic conditions for the industry. There is too much floating stock these days and the boats in operation need to deliver a ROI that makes them competitive. Sad but real reality.


Yeah I know I'm opening the door for all the LLT! replies...but if indeed the Algosteel is being marketed...is there a company who may be interested in purchasing her?

That's what I've been wondering myself. Who would buy her?. Not CSL, not any American fleets. LLT might if they were looking for a boat to buy.

[jzcleve]

I can't imagine much of a market for the Algosteel unfortunately if business is that soft - which it is across all sectors. What shape is the Algosar in? When it was with Cleveland Tankers I heard it was immaculately maintained? Would the Algosar also be a candidate for sale for off-lakes use?

[Lakerguy]

[quote="Guest"]The Algosteel may find a buyer. It's being marketed. The other 5 are being mothballed for now and will remain so until the price of scrap is more promising. I work for the company and its a combo of the boats meeting their end lives, the new boats we have introduced and sobering economic conditions for the industry. There is too much floating stock these days and the boats in operation need to deliver a ROI that makes them competitive. Sad but real reality.


Yeah I know I'm opening the door for all the LLT! replies...but if indeed the Algosteel is being marketed...is there a company who may be interested in purchasing her?

[lakerfan]

There would be little incentive to pursue CCTA waivers if Canadian owners would follow Desgagnes example and invest in modern multipurpose tonnage but they do not so opening the door to allowing FOC ships into our cabotage trade. You snooze you (meaning Canadian sailors) lose.

[Mac Mackay]

The coasting licenses are a lot cheaper than hiring a Canadian ship. And there is quite a skill in applying for a license. You line up a foreign ship, make sure it is available and ready, even though there may be a Canadian ones with no work, or open schedules.
Then you wait to the last possible second to apply for the license, then write a specification for the ship which the available Canadian ship can't meet and bingo - no suitable Canadian ship is available.
You then have the foreign ship, with foreign crew costs and registration fees, and no obligation beyond the time of the short term charter.
Canadian sailors are the losers that is for sure.

[old sailer]

Strange indeed that algoma is having problems getting cargoes for their tanker fleet. Seems to me that the cons handed out several special coasting permits in 2015 for a foreign flag tanker. Looks like a bad year ahead for Canadian Sailers.

[Guest]

Desgagnes took over Algoma tankers. Right now the Esta and Maria Desgagnes are on the run.

[Paul Beesley]

Irving has several tankers on the East Coast. One or two are registered in Canada and can therefore trade between Canadian ports. The rest are flagged offshore and regularly trade between the US and Canada. For example, one may go first to Boston, then Saint John, New Brunswick, then Portland Maine etc.

Acadian - http://shipfax.blogspot.com/2012/02/aca ... -flag.html

They have also chartered one or two that do the same US/Canada trade. One is called the Iver Progress and it frequently comes to Portland from Saint John.

Iver Progress - http://www.marinetraffic.com/ais/detail ... R_PROGRESS

[Guest]

The Algosteel may find a buyer. It's being marketed. The other 5 are being mothballed for now and will remain so until the price of scrap is more promising. I work for the company and its a combo of the boats meeting their end lives, the new boats we have introduced and sobering economic conditions for the industry. There is too much floating stock these days and the boats in operation need to deliver a ROI that makes them competitive. Sad but real reality.

They are Algosar, Algomarine, Peter R. Cresswell, Algoma Navigator, and probably Algosoo, Algosteel.

As has been said a number of times before, Algoway and Algorail have current surveys and will run until their replacements arrive.

[cpfan]

Anyone know as to who Algoma may have lost the east coast tanker trade to. Also is there any chance that some of their lake trade has been taken over by Federal Commerce as I see a story in the Toronto Star today of the Federal Hudson unloading grain in Hamilton.

Not sure that they lost the East Coast trade to a competitor, but rather because a refinery shut down.

Federal ships are not flagged Canadian (although owned by a Canadian company) so cannot carry from one Canadian port to another.

The story that I found is not about Fed Hudson, it's just a caption to a picture. The caption could be wrong. Federal ships often carry grain outbound.

Steve

[garbear]

Anyone know as to who Algoma may have lost the east coast tanker trade to. Also is there any chance that some of their lake trade has been taken over by Federal Commerce as I see a story in the Toronto Star today of the Federal Hudson unloading grain in Hamilton.

Seeing there are no boats/ships sailing because of locks being closed, etc., that's an old photo of the Federal Hudson the Star took out of their archives. I would guess they got the caption wrong on the photo. The Hudson is light, so my guess they are loading grain at the elevator. Think it's the P & H grain terminal. Also, if Fednav had taken over Algoma it would have been big news. Nothing has been reported.

[old sailer]

Anyone know as to who Algoma may have lost the east coast tanker trade to. Also is there any chance that some of their lake trade has been taken over by Federal Commerce as I see a story in the Toronto Star today of the Federal Hudson unloading grain in Hamilton.

[tugboathunter]

There's not much clarity on this situation, but Algosteel is rumored to be inactive this season, and available if needed. Rumors also indicate that Algomarine could run in the Spring.

Regarding the Algosar, although she is in drydock, I'm not sure that she is having any work done. Since Algoma has leased the drydocks for the winter (Algoma Guardian 5-year), they likely just wanted a place where they could lay her up. It also wouldn't surprise me to see Algoma continue to shrink its tanker fleet based on the loss of their east coast trades, which is the reason Algoscotia is on charter in Europe. AlgoCanada and Algoma Hansa have been surprisingly inactive all winter as well.

[Bill]

Algosteel underwent extensive steel work in the winter of 2012 at Port Colborne before heading that spring to dry dock at Port Weller for five year survey and painting.
I would think at the very least she's available for one more season depending on cargo demands in 2016.

[Guest]

They are Algosar, Algomarine, Peter R. Cresswell, Algoma Navigator, and probably Algosoo, Algosteel.

As has been said a number of times before, Algoway and Algorail have current surveys and will run until their replacements arrive.

Algoway is due to be retired in 2017. No word on Algorail yet.

[St Crapo]

If the Algosar is finished, then what is going on with her at Port Weller drydock this winter? Seems odd that if she's finished that they would have her in drydock unless she's possibly being sold to another company overseas.
Dan McNeil