Guest wrote:Its not just shipping companies its everything example public school board 30 yrs ago you could eat off the floors proactive maintenance done schools look really good, now just enough staff to take the garbage out, grass used to be cut weekly now cut few times a yr, anyone who worked in the 70s and 80s and was brought up in that working culture would have a hard time today!
I grew up during the 70s and early 80s and began working in the early 80s and yes there has definitely been a major shift in how things are being maintained. It seems like at one time buildings, even those built for retailers and fast-food restaurants, were built and maintained a lot better than those being constructed today. The same goes for many of the factory complexes I have worked with over the years. Even houses seem to have fallen into this new paradigm as when I was looking to buy a house a few years ago I found that many of the ranch homes from 1960s through the mid-1970s were holding up better than houses built after the 1990s. It was amazing to see houses only 10-15 years old to be having serious foundation problems.
Its not just shipping companies its everything example public school board 30 yrs ago you could eat off the floors proactive maintenance done schools look really good, now just enough staff to take the garbage out, grass used to be cut weekly now cut few times a yr, anyone who worked in the 70s and 80s and was brought up in that working culture would have a hard time today!
I sailed in kind of two periods. Back in the 1970s, and then again fairly recently. Mostly a lot of pride in the job and the company years ago. Most lines officers wore uniforms, proper amount of guys to do the work. Regular card games. Not like that now.
Never sailed. I'm actually a young boatnerd, only in my 20s, but have been following the ships ever since I could walk. Even in the 20 years I have been boatwatching, I've seen the major digression of fleet pride and care for ships. I suppose it is part of the way our culture works today, but it used to be that every one of the fleets had a certain pride in their vessels and kept them looking nice. I don't know, if I was a broker or an iron producer, I would certainly look at how the fleet hauling my cargo would look, since in my opinion, conveys much about the attitude of the company, but I could be wrong on that observation.
guest wrote:andrew, did you ever sail? in the 70s i was on a straight decker. we had 6 deckhands the ship was well kept. fast forward to 2021 and your lucky if there are 2 deckhands. as far as a company cares its the bottom line, not how pretty the vessel looks like for boatnerds with cameras
I agree! The reductions in crews has definitely taken a toll in how well ships are being maintained. I'm certain that environmental regulations also affect how and when the painting is carried out. Unfortunately, it seems that over the past 20 years there has been a move to minimize maintenance costs within the North American industrial segment. I have seen this trend develop within industrial manufacturing and it seems to have also affected the transportation segment. This along with a general reluctance to impart significant cash flows to R&D requirements, from my experience anyway, seems to be more prominent in publicly traded companies in comparison to privately-held entities. But I will admit I have no personal insight into the shipping industry other than as a hobby. I do agree that the shipping companies care more about the bottom line than how ships look for enthusiasts and that is how it should be. However, paint does not just make something look better as its primary purpose is to protect the material it is coating. I have seen companies that won kudos from corporate headquarters for cutting their maintenance costs only to require major investments later down the road to correct problems that could have been prevented. On the other side of this discussion is the possibility that many of these ships may be operating with much service life left from either age or diminishing cargoes or even a combination of both. If that is the case, then there would definitely be a reason to minimize maintenance expenditures. I recall reading somewhere about a report generated for the Wilson Transit fleet in the 1960s that contained the estimated service life remaining for their vessels. I'm certain that shipping companies continue to generate such confindential internal reports and those would be very interesting reading.
Amazingly I’ve seen some Saltwater Vessels painted up better than I have some of the laker fleets both American and Canadians. Although I admit, not every Saltwater Ship looks top notch worth its current paint job and scheme, a few I’ve seen that look ok are Wagenborg, Fednav and Canfornav as far as Salties go. Going back to the Laker fleets, I recall in the past that Oglebay Norton when they were in business used to take very good care of their ships and try to keep them painted up well and nice. Of course that was then this is now and today. One I do miss seeing is the old Pioneer fleet colors. I used to love their scheme and when they had Saskatchewan Pioneer, Silver Isle and Senneviille those three were great with the Pioneer colors and billboard lettering!
andrew, did you ever sail? in the 70s i was on a straight decker. we had 6 deckhands the ship was well kept. fast forward to 2021 and your lucky if there are 2 deckhands. as far as a company cares its the bottom line, not how pretty the vessel looks like for boatnerds with cameras
I'd say of current fleets, Interlake and CML/Arcelor/Cliffs take the best care of their ships. GLF has, in my opinion, really let things slide the last decade. Agreed, used to be a lot of pride in keeping your boats looking good. Not much of that left, especially on the Canadian side it seems. I know part of it has to do with EPA and paint regulations, but still. Some of the ships on the lakes look terrible. I dont know the last time I saw an Interlake or a CML boat look bad, so it must be something beyond regulations.
Quote:” Those two are some of the oldest ships around and both kept up very nice and well thanks to two companies both Interlake and GLF that take pride in keeping their boats looking sharp! ”.
Wow, we use to have to fight to get paint for the GLF vessels. The crews were the ones that wanted to keep their vessel looking sharp. The best looking was the Clarke. If you didn’t have a cable in your hand, the bosun made sure that you had a paint brush. GLF office staff “ Paint doesn’t make the vessel haul more cargo”. Well if it rusts away underneath your feet, then it won’t haul any cargo.
I agree with you all on the Sykes and the Weir. While I've seen both the Sykes and the Courtney Burton later American Fortitude, I never saw it as the Weir as that was well before my time. Also agree about Alpena as well being another classic and nice looking boat too. Less not forget a few of the other classics such as Lee A. Tregurtha and the Anderson as well. Those two are some of the oldest ships around and both kept up very nice and well thanks to two companies both Interlake and GLF that take pride in keeping their boats looking sharp! I would also throw in the LLT ships such as Michipicoten, Saginaw and the Cuyahoga. Yeah I do know that Cuyahoga carries a few salt loads and when in service so did the Mississagi but at least LLT did ok in keeping all their classics looking good in spite of hauling some salt loads. That goes without saying what Algoma has been doing to their ships lately! Talk about rust buckets in their fleet geez. And their new Equinox Class ships, some of them are already looking terrible and nasty from rubbing up on walls. Some of them, their names are now starting to rub and wear off from rubbing up on the walls lately also.
Agreed. I'd take either of them over the Ryerson any day. Of the two, Sykes takes the cake because of the paint scheme. She's kept very well, too. I appreciate that about her owners and the same goes for ILM with the Alpena. They take pride in their ships.
That is one good looking ship. The Sykes and Ernest T. Weir (later Courtney Burton & American Fortitude) are, in my opinion, some of the most appealing and well proportioned vessels to have ever been built for Great Lakes service.
Probably weather. 10-12 foot seas in Duluth yesterday. Sadly will not be coming up there for her this time...4 hours one way for a day trip is a bit much. So, hoping for good pictures.
Harborlookout.com indicates the Wilfred Sykes arriving on Tuesday morning. Can anyone confirm? The system harborlookout uses sometimes is a bit unreliable on long term scheduling, so curious if anyone on the ground or in the know can offer something. It seems too good to be true. But if it is true I have some time off and would strongly consider the 4 hour trek to see her go under the bridge.