Maumee

[Andy V]

It is not permitted under the Jones act to bring ships back that have been sold overseas. Thus Mississagi or Saginaw could not rejoin the GRN fleet from LLT. It would require a waiver from congress to make that happen, and is why GRN would invest in CTC #1 instead of bringing say the Mississagi back US and replacing her with the James Norris, for instance (just an example)

[Brent]

If the boat was built in the US and was flagged Canadian and brought back to US flagged there would be no duty.

[Guest]

They did get the KK contracts, and none of the vessels from Algoma could replace the Maumee on U.S. flag runs.

True, but if they needed to expand their Canadian fleet as well, one option might be to re-allocate the CTC#1 or one of the other US-flag boats, which they wouldn't need to do if they were able to pick up surplus tonnage from Algoma (either directly or via a third-party sale ala Maritime Trader or J.W. Shelley). Also, what's the final verdict on bringing back one of the American-built boats from their Canadian fleet? Doable? Not doable? That seems to be a gray area in the Jones Act as far as I can tell.

look at the Sara Spencer for your answer

[Guest]

They did get the KK contracts, and none of the vessels from Algoma could replace the Maumee on U.S. flag runs.

True, but if they needed to expand their Canadian fleet as well, one option might be to re-allocate the CTC#1 or one of the other US-flag boats, which they wouldn't need to do if they were able to pick up surplus tonnage from Algoma (either directly or via a third-party sale ala Maritime Trader or J.W. Shelley). Also, what's the final verdict on bringing back one of the American-built boats from their Canadian fleet? Doable? Not doable? That seems to be a gray area in the Jones Act as far as I can tell.

I believe, if they paid a duty on it, they could bring a vessel back into service under the U.S. flag. Not sure what the duty is but I know for a fact it's pretty expensive.

[Richard Jenkins]

They did get the KK contracts, and none of the vessels from Algoma could replace the Maumee on U.S. flag runs.

True, but if they needed to expand their Canadian fleet as well, one option might be to re-allocate the CTC#1 or one of the other US-flag boats, which they wouldn't need to do if they were able to pick up surplus tonnage from Algoma (either directly or via a third-party sale ala Maritime Trader or J.W. Shelley). Also, what's the final verdict on bringing back one of the American-built boats from their Canadian fleet? Doable? Not doable? That seems to be a gray area in the Jones Act as far as I can tell.

[Guest]

Sounds like they're still weighing their options at this point. Obviously they gain some capacity with the Kuber barges, but did they get Kuber's cargo contracts along with them? If so, they may not make up completely for the loss of Maumee's capacity. As the economy improves, they will most likely need to add new capacity anyway. Then the big question becomes, slap a band-aid on the Maumee, or invest in the longer-term rebuild of the CTC #1?

There's also the distinct possibility that other suitable boats will go on the market in the very near future. Will ASC sell off their steamers? What will Algoma do with the Canadian Transfer or James Norris, or longer term with the Algorail or Algoway? Will either of these fleets sell them a boat at all? What about the American Republic when her lease expires?

Either way, the cost of keeping Maumee in layup for a year or two while they wait and see what transpires is going to be less than the cost of buying another ship, even at scrap value.

They did get the KK contracts, and none of the vessels from Algoma could replace the Maumee on U.S. flag runs.

[Richard Jenkins]

Sounds like they're still weighing their options at this point. Obviously they gain some capacity with the Kuber barges, but did they get Kuber's cargo contracts along with them? If so, they may not make up completely for the loss of Maumee's capacity. As the economy improves, they will most likely need to add new capacity anyway. Then the big question becomes, slap a band-aid on the Maumee, or invest in the longer-term rebuild of the CTC #1?

There's also the distinct possibility that other suitable boats will go on the market in the very near future. Will ASC sell off their steamers? What will Algoma do with the Canadian Transfer or James Norris, or longer term with the Algorail or Algoway? Will either of these fleets sell them a boat at all? What about the American Republic when her lease expires?

Either way, the cost of keeping Maumee in layup for a year or two while they wait and see what transpires is going to be less than the cost of buying another ship, even at scrap value.

[em ford]

So my question is if she's got so much wrong with her and no plans in the near future to fix her why are they holding onto her? Why not just sail or tow her to the scrap yard like they did with the myron c.taylor? Isn't it costing a lot of money to have her just sit at a dock? If she is going to be scrapped where would she go? Ims or is it possible she could go to the soo where the ford is?

[Guest]

The Cargill rumour has been around for awhile and is just that. A rumour... Maumee will not be getting the work done.

[st crapo]

So if cargrill does put the money in and gets her threw a 5 year survey will she haul just salt or pick up the accasional load of stone and coal? What ports would she call on?

[Guest]

From what I've heard, Cargill will be putting the money into the Maumee to get her up to standards to sail again, still bring ran by GRN.

Why would Cargill be putting money into the Maumee? Isn't Cargill a grain company?

The Cargill they're referring to is a salt company.

[Leo]

That directly contradicts what they said less than a month ago. But things change quick at times in this industry, so let's hope it happens.

Cargill is a pretty big company that deals with more than just grain. They appear to also deal with other agricultural products, various industrial products, steel, and salt (That last one should be familiar to anyone that has followed the Maumee in recent years).

Road salt seems like the most obvious match for the Maumee, if true. It seems to be a major part of Cargill and hauling road salt was certainly a major role for the Maumee. So without knowing anything more, that would be my bet if true.

http://www.cargill.com/company/business ... /index.jsp

[Guest]

From what I've heard, Cargill will be putting the money into the Maumee to get her up to standards to sail again, still bring ran by GRN.

Why would Cargill be putting money into the Maumee? Isn't Cargill a grain company?

[guest]

From what I've heard, Cargill will be putting the money into the Maumee to get her up to standards to sail again, still bring ran by GRN.

[ashland69]

Lower Lakes has already said otherwise. When they announced the purchase of the two barges, they stated "as a result of this acquisition we have elected to defer a drydocking and major capital expenditure program planned for this winter for our smallest, oldest and least profitable vessel." That means the Maumee, of course.

Just what that means for the Maumee is unknown (Going to scrap in the near future or be held in reserve in case demand possibly warrants the expendenture to keep her going for a little while longer a few years down the road before possibly modernizing the CTC #1 to take her place permanently). But what it does say is that any current consideration to put more money into her isn't on the table any longer. She's done for, at least for now, and likely has sailed her last.

You're right, Leo and I stand corrected. LLT did indeed say that they weren't going to put any more into Maumee for now. In the longterm, I agree, she's probably sailed her last.

[Leo]

Lower Lakes has already said otherwise. When they announced the purchase of the two barges, they stated "as a result of this acquisition we have elected to defer a drydocking and major capital expenditure program planned for this winter for our smallest, oldest and least profitable vessel." That means the Maumee, of course.

Just what that means for the Maumee is unknown (Going to scrap in the near future or be held in reserve in case demand possibly warrants the expendenture to keep her going for a little while longer a few years down the road before possibly modernizing the CTC #1 to take her place permanently). But what it does say is that any current consideration to put more money into her isn't on the table any longer. She's done for, at least for now, and likely has sailed her last.

[ashland69]

I've heard some rumors going around on a few discussion board posts about vessels replacing the Maumee. Is the Maumee heading for the scrap yard this year or is she going to remain in service for a few more years?

Last I heard, LLT was going to assess Maumee and see just exactly what is going to be required to get her thru another 5-year. There's been discussion about the K&K barges replacing the Maumee's tonnage, and recently, there's been discussion about LLT possibly getting the American Republic and using her on Maumee's runs. Personally, I don't think Maumee is going to run again.

[Guest]

Unknown at this time. She needs a five year survey as well as repairs to the crack in her deck before she can sail again.

[Guest]

I've heard some rumors going around on a few discussion board posts about vessels replacing the Maumee. Is the Maumee heading for the scrap yard this year or is she going to remain in service for a few more years?